Mr. Mercedes S2
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[00:00:00] Deanna Chapman: Hey everyone, Chat Sematary is back. I'm your host, Deanna Chapman. And today I am once again, joined by Terry Mesnard to discuss Mr. Mercedes season two. If you have not listened to our season one episode, it was quite a few weeks ago since we're doing these by season and in chronological order, there's a bit of a gap here, but Terry, thank you for joining me once again.

[00:00:23] Terry Mesnard: Thanks for having me on. I had a great time talking in season one in. So excited to talk about this season because, um, if you listen to last episode, the last episode that I was on, I've not read this book. So I'm, I have questions.

[00:00:38] Deanna Chapman: I love questions. I was surprised that they went this way with it and skipped ahead.

So this season is covering end of watch because you know, the first few episodes I was like, okay, maybe they're just following up on Brady story. And then they're going to get into finder's keepers and, you know, they never did. And I was like, Oh, they're doing end of watch. And it took me a few episodes to realize that because I was like, okay, you know, maybe they're just shaking it up a little and giving us more of a Brady update than finders keepers did.

But with end of watch, you know, you've read finder's keepers though, right? Oh yeah. Okay. In finders keepers for anyone who needs a quick recap, we see the opening of finder's keepers. We have a totally different case. We do get bits and pieces of Brady here and there, but you know, it's end of watch when his character really comes back and everything sort of comes full circle.

So, you know, this season I have to admit, we got a lot more scenes of Brady in the hospital than I was expecting.

[00:01:46] Terry Mesnard: Okay. If I have one complaint about this season, The, and I get it. You have an actor like Harry Treadaway. You need to give him something to do. I did not really care for all of the scenes spent in his mind.

And I really didn't care for the amount of time focused on his, on him, in the hospital. I get why they did that. And I think the reason probably why they decided to skip a finder's keepers for season two is because if you're going to try to complete the story. You need to have him and you need to make sure that you can tie him down for a second season, as opposed to being like, Hey, I need you to be in a couple episodes or a couple scenes.

If we're going to do finder's keepers and then you need to come back in the third season. I think they probably felt like we needed to get this, you know, locked and loaded while we're done. It's unfortunate because this, the season feels. It's kind of finite and I kind of wonder, and I, like, we talked about last episode when we, when we did, uh, Mr.

Mercedes season one, I kind of wonder if, because this was on audience, if maybe they didn't know if they're going to get a another season. And so they wanted to kind of find a way to tie up the. There are tied the story of him because season one does end with him in a coma that we need to have sort of like an ending point to it.

And I kind of wonder if that's why they did it this way, but it, I don't know. It's just, it feels a little too finite for me to then go on to a whole new case afterwards and season in third year.

[00:03:13] Deanna Chapman: Yeah, because the way the books work really, and, you know, I don't want to give away too much of the book since you haven't read it, but you know, finder's keepers is, Hey, Brady's in Acoma.

We don't need to spend time with him. You know, bill will go pop in and out of the hospital and. They can kind of move on with their lives. So I thought they were still going to do like another case with this, but instead they, you know, they really do a lot of the things that are in the book, like the zap it's thing with the, those tablets.

And they didn't explain that quite as well as I was hoping because. It was lost. If I'm remembering correctly in the book, it was more like this company had bought them all up and was just giving them away for free. And that's how like Barbara and her friends got them and, you know, Barbara. Bigger role in that sense in the book.

And we already talked about how she was sidelined. So I wasn't surprised that she was still sidelined in this season, but you know, you can tell there's this obsession with the tablets. And I think they were hoping that would be enough, but they don't really explain it well enough. It's like this very specific fish.

Where you're tapping on different fish and different colors. And that is how Brady is sort of mind controlling people, but then you have Sadie, the nurse. Is epileptic and doesn't play the game. And I was like, oh, okay. And not to say, I didn't like this season because I did still have things that I enjoyed about this season, but it felt like if you had not read the book, like you said, you're going to have some questions I had.

[00:05:02] Terry Mesnard: A lot of structural issues in terms of the way that things were kind of laid out in this season. I, I do think overall there's some really great things and I can not wait to talk about this ending because the ending surprised the hell out of me. I, it started early where, cause in, in season one we see Ida at a job and she is at.

A funeral parlor. And, um, and then here she is a teacher or she is summer school. Oh, it's summer school. I was like, I don't understand how she can go from that to now. She's like teaching school and she's just handing out these red knock-off iPad type things. And I'm like, what? It's just one little scene.

And I'm like, why, what is this doing in here? And then you start to see them show up a little bit later. And I'm like, I guess that's how he's controlling him, but it didn't really. Do anything for me. And I guess not having read the book, I was like, I don't understand why this is in here. I don't understand how he's able to control CD, I guess the epilepsy.

I wasn't quite sure how he was able to control Al I guess the, I, it just, there was a lot of questions that I had in terms of how this, the logistics of his mind control was

[00:06:05] Deanna Chapman: working. There was some disconnect with it. I don't think. Too hard to understand that he was mine controlling people at all, but with him being able to like see through his eyes and then other people's eyes and you know, that whole thing where we're kind of inside his mind and.

In the book because Barbara does play a larger role in the books. You have her with one of the tablets, and we do see her in like one or two scenes with the tablet and she's playing the game or whatever. And she's like, oh, I haven't gotten this high of a score before, whatever it was in passing. And you know, that plays a much bigger role.

Which makes it hit closer to home for bill and Jerome specifically because it's his sister, you know, so you're missing that whole element of this. We do spend too much time in Brady's head. I would agree with that. Cora is a new character. Not that Dr. Babineau didn't have a wife in the. But she just was, it was kind of like, you know, she took on the Ida role almost this season because she just kept popping in more and more.

And, you know, we were getting more and more familiar with her and. That final episode, you really just have so much going on at that point. It's like in season one, you had moments where you had multiple big things happen. You know, you had Janie's death. Then you had the scene in the final episode where he stops Lou and he wants to bomb this place.

And you know, you have multiple big events, whereas here. Because he's in a coma the whole time, the big events that happen, like Sadie committing suicide and everything that happens without, it just doesn't feel as big. It felt like, you know, Because those deaths weren't connected to any characters, we really cared about.

Sure. You know, you have Bill's nurse friend at the hospital who obviously cared about Sadie and you know, that sort of thing, it just felt like. Those didn't hit on the same level. They definitely

[00:08:20] Terry Mesnard: weren't as impactful as the, as the deaths and in season one. And I think you're hitting on exactly why it didn't, it wasn't impactful for me out too, because we don't know these people.

Um, yeah, Al is really, it's, it's kind of a sad story in the middle because of, um, you know, he, he is not really understanding what is going on and the scene where he kills his brother. You know, goes to try to kill bill. It was, it was sad and it kind of added to this whole like ongoing tragedy that Mr.

Mercedes started in, in the, in the first season and kind of continues on here, but it just didn't, um, hit as much as some of the deaths in the first, uh, season. And I don't think the moments throughout the entire season ignoring the last episode, I don't think the events that were sort of the big kind of climatic moments were.

Powerful because of

[00:09:09] Deanna Chapman: that here. Yeah. You also have the fact that, you know, in season one, we talked about Brady's mother's death and how brutal and horrific that was. And then you have something in season two, like Al's brother's death that just did not look good. Like when he slit his throat with the, you know, the barber knife or whatever you call, I don't know.

I don't go to barbers, but you know, it just did not. Hold up as well as I think the mom's death did in season one, it was one of those things. I was like that. Did it remotely look real?

[00:09:48] Terry Mesnard: No. And it definitely does the thing that I hate where this season has used. Uh, computer-generated blood, um, here, and then also in the kind of climatic moment of this, of this season and it kind of cheapens the whole feel of it.

If I'm going to be honest, I I'm wondering if the budget, uh, wasn't as big as the first one. Um, because even though there are some crowd scenes here that have a lot more people than I ever saw in season one outside of the opening, I don't think that the effects work was done as well as a seasoned one.

Particularly I'm thinking again, back to the mother's horrific death.

[00:10:23] Deanna Chapman: Yeah. Let's talk about the depth in episode one though, of this season that I think we feel a little more than the rest in the season because you know, Pete is Bill's former partner. He isn't necessarily a character you love or hate.

He's just kind of a character who is there. And, you know, he's kind of the tough love for bill and, you know, he's like, dude, I have a job to do. And I just want to. Not what happens in the book. So I'll leave it at

[00:10:52] Terry Mesnard: that. Yeah. I, um, again, the, the tragedy feel and the trauma feel of, of this, of the season, the fact that we have Pete retiring and he's like having all these plans about what he's going to do post retirement, and then he just sort of unceremoniously drops.

In Bill's, uh, kitchen it's it's, it's just, it was sad and you're right. We don't really have much of a feeling on Pete other than he was the character that didn't really believe a bill in the first season. And he just sort of played sort of like the partner aspect and showed up once in a while we care because he has a history with bill.

And so the fact that that is like the first death of the season, I thought was also the. Tragic aspect of it. Cause I was like, oh, I was happy to see him back. And then it's like, oh.

[00:11:40] Deanna Chapman: You're gone. I do want to say that despite Pete stuff happening so early in the season, it still felt like it didn't hit as hard because, you know, we weren't expecting it, but I feel like, you know, by the time you and I are sitting here talking about it, I almost forgot about it because it was just so sudden and kind of nonchalant.

It's

[00:12:03] Terry Mesnard: very unceremonious. Yeah. And I honestly. I forgot that it happened until you, you mentioned Pete. And I was like, oh yeah, that's right. He did tie in the beginning of the season. I just remember it kind of being like, oh, that's really sad because you know, he's finally able to live his life after giving himself up to an a career.

[00:12:21] Deanna Chapman: Yeah. And he seemed to play a bigger role in the books too, because you know, bill basically kept showing up at crime scenes, which he doesn't. Quite as much, you know, he obviously shows up at everything that is related to like Brady's house and things like that. But what I recall from the books is that there were other murder scenes that bill just kept showing up to.

And Pete's new partner, Izzy. Had a much bigger role in the books too, because she kind of had this tension between her and Holly, you know, they didn't like each other and that is also missing from this. But I think because of the fact that they brought Ida in and made her such a focus in season one, and then, you know, they bring Cora in as Dr.

Babineau his wife. You had to cut something somewhere. And I think, you know, we see Izzy in a few scenes. She doesn't have a ton of lines in season one, and we didn't even mention her this use of one episode. We didn't even really talk about Pete. I think that kind of just goes to show how almost forgettable they made those characters, unfortunately, until sort of Pete's death in this.

And you're like, oh, that's a consequence. We kind of weren't expecting.

[00:13:40] Terry Mesnard: Yeah. They were just sort of an obstacle in season one, just sort of a plot related obstacle too, to kind of give bill a different. Uh, roadblock in his, in his kind of quest to take down Mr. Mercedes. And they didn't really feel like, I guess they really didn't feel like real, real people in that, in that regard, compared to the rest of the cast that, uh, the first season rolled out and kind of deep into a bit more here in a season.

[00:14:06] Deanna Chapman: Yeah. One of the things that the end of watch book does too, is it kind of bounces back and forth between present day and the Mercedes killings. So, you know, it's kind of jumping back and forth timeline wise, and we don't get that in this season at all, really, except for, you know, a couple little things here and there with Brady, like seeing himself sitting in the car or something like that, I think, and they change.

A lot of Dr. Babineau story too, because in, um, I'm trying to do this without spoiling them. Okay. So in the book he takes over, Babineau like he does with Al and you know, he does it with Al too. I don't remember if that was exactly the character's name, but you know, the guy with the library card and. He sort of builds up to taking over the doctor and that's how he just gets out of the hospital because, you know, he is kind of at the point where his body's not going to recover.

He takes over the doctors, mind and body entirely and wants to kill bill and Holly and Jerome. And, you know, they kind of go out to the. Cabin in the woods almost. And it's like super snowy and it's very hard to get there. And there's like this big show down and to just have Brady walk straight out of the hospital, I was like, oh, okay, sure.

I guess we're going with that.

[00:15:38] Terry Mesnard: The characters in this season are not very smart. Uh, the da, uh, in particular, uh, Tony, the way that no one seems to realize that there's Lu. Who could, you know, they're, they're talking around, we need someone that's known him before and after, and all the people are dead and I'm like, excuse me.

What about Lou? And it takes forever for them to get to, oh my gosh. There's Lou. And then the idea that. That I don't know the whole case, the whole courtroom aspect of trying to determine whether he is competent enough. It's one of those things that sounds really good on paper, but I do not think really kind of holds up when it's being talked about, because I'm sitting here thinking.

Isn't it suspicious that a pharmaceutical company is backing his defense when his defense is that he is a lab rat and that the pharmaceutical company changed him against his will. And I'm like, doesn't this seem a little bit suspicious and not going to hold up in court. And there's a lot of those kinds of moments in here where I'm just like, this is not working.

And, and Brady just walking out of the hospital, just kind of continues on with that. And as much as I kind of appreciated the sort of like irony, where, and the. Companion piece to the first season. We're in the first season, he is able to kind of mentally, uh, convince people to kill themselves. And that is like what he does to the woman that owned the Mercedes car.

And we have him as, as that sort of like figuratively controlling people. And here we have them literally controlling people. I thought it was kind of an interesting, you know, dynamic, but I don't think it's used as much because he literally just controls. The, uh, the nurse to have her jump off after a failed, you know, trying to kill Brady and then Al I'm like, I don't, this doesn't feel as fleshed out as I wanted it to be.

Yeah.

[00:17:22] Deanna Chapman: I think they. Wanted us to really spend a lot of time looking at Brady's chapped lips, which is there were probably 20, too many of those shots. And again, I still enjoyed what they did because the way they changed things, mostly made sense. The mind control stuff is a little iffy, but as far as the.

Experimentation the drugs Babineau wanting to do it sort of for the recognition. And you know, it's very clear that his wife is just so adamant about having everything go her way. Like she supposed to be this straw. Boss woman. And at the same time, you know, you really want to like characters like that because we see so few of them, but she's just so terrible.

[00:18:20] Terry Mesnard: She really is.

The only positive note I wrote down on here, um, was when she was talking about names for the baby and her idea was a name that could be either gender, because what if the baby wants to transition later? I was like, yes, I like that. That's a good moment. And then everything else about her was just like, oh, you're kind of a horrible person.

And I, it made me actually start to realize that a lot of the women in this, in this particularly this season kind of fall into the camp of the supportive person or like the antagonist. Cause you, you have like all the people that are supporting a bill in terms of like, Holly, is that sort of supportive woman and Ida is, and you have that.

And Donna, and then you also have the sort of like, Evil woman. And there's like, no, in between, it's just, you either are the supportive person that is doing everything it can to make the man succeed, or you all are trying to manipulate the men and make them do things for your will. And it just that dichotomy, it just like it's we have two different kinds of women this and that's about it.

[00:19:22] Deanna Chapman: Yeah. It's funny, I just quickly looked up the Wikipedia page for the series and it says here on rotten tomatoes, season one has an 83% out of 29 reviews overall. And then season two has 100% from 11 reviews overall. And I'm just like, I'm kind of surprised that this got a bump with season two, because it's the same with the Metacritic score it.

That one is 71 with more reviews than season two, but season two got a 76 out of a hundred. And. I think maybe if you haven't read the books, this is okay. You know, you've read two out of three. So you kind of already got to know Brady through the books and to have this be sort of flipping spots with finder's keepers.

As far as the show goes, I imagine it was a little confusing because you're like, hold on. I don't think this is where book three was going. It is, but it isn't, you know, in the book, he also has like other things going on. Like he can move objects and he turns water on and off and, you know, just smaller things that kind of feel like they're building up to something.

I felt like we didn't have that.

[00:20:44] Terry Mesnard: No. And that was one thing that, cause I did, I did read finder's keepers and I remember the scenes in there were like the hospital staff is spooked because they're seeing things move and there's, you know, starting to think that maybe he's controlling it. And that was an interesting aspect of it.

Cause it's subtly introduced as in terms of like more supernatural or other worldly aspect of the story that kind of gets introduced slowly and finders keepers. And then I guess is kind of going. You know, ham in the end of watch. And here, I think when you go from a very grounded down to earth, Procedural type story from season one.

And then all of a sudden it's like, Nope, we're talking mind control. When you're talking, we're taking an inspiration from Frankenstein. We are literally going to call him Frankenstein, which is ironic because Harry Treadaway played Frankenstein in penny dreadful. And here he is being with Frankenstein's monster here in this, in this.

And I was like, oh, I see what you're doing here. But. It's it's such a sudden shift between the two seasons that it kind of, it made me feel a little discombobulated. Cause I'm like, how, how was this, how was this going from a very grounded for season to a more other worldly aspect of it in such a, a quick, quick moment.

[00:22:01] Deanna Chapman: Yeah, because with the books you have that. Through finders keepers. You don't really know what's going to happen with Brady. You know, he's not dead, you know, he's going to come back. Some way, shape or form. And in this, you don't get that beat. You don't get to take time away from Brady, which they could have done.

They could have just thrown in some, you know, little cases and, you know, they kind of do that, but at the same time, they kind of threw in Sadie's mom more. And I was just like, eh, this is okay. And again, I still enjoyed this. And looking forward to season three, which I have not started yet when we're recording this.

And. We didn't do any ratings for season one and we probably won't do any here. I do think I want to kind of do that as a whole. Once we talk about season three, because you know, with the books, they do stand on their own. But I think once you read all three and full, it really just gives you this bigger picture.

It's kind of like reading the dark tower books, but for detective stories, you know, king is very good at giving you this piece of the story that is a beginning, middle and end. But also just the beginning of the full story.

[00:23:19] Terry Mesnard: Yes. Um, yeah. Okay. Could we talk about this ending though? Because I thought this ending was fascinating.

I was a little kind of, I wouldn't say bored, but I was a little confused. I didn't know what to expect in this last episode because Brady of course gets, it turns himself in, in episode nine and I'm like, okay, what is, what are you trying to do here? What is your ultimate goal? Because we know he's not changed.

We know he's still. Uh, vicious sociopath at this point, even though everyone else seems to be completely hoodwinked by him, which was like, I don't whatever, but we have this ending that is like the exact opposite of the, of season one Denning season one had a more bombastic, even though it was a little muted in terms of what happens in the book with the like sort of explode, the, the idea that he's going to blow himself up and make his masterpiece.

And here we have a courtroom drama reduced to one episode, but. It bringing back Lou who I wanted more of this season. Cause they did a really good job in the beginning kind of keeping her alive or keeping her character arc alive. And then she sort of vanishes a little bit in this. To like last part of it.

And then she comes back in around to like bring it everything home. But I loved the scene. I loved the best in here in the scene. I thought that was the most subtle character work was the discussion between Lou and Brady, where she is like talking to him. And you can tell that, that I was just thinking about how horrible for her.

This would feel where she's stabbed. She's having to face the person that almost killed her. And she even says kind of did kill her at one point. And that whole scene, I thought it was just such a fascinating way to end or wait to set up the end of this, of this season.

[00:25:06] Deanna Chapman: It was very, very uncertain once I was like, oh, they're going to actually do law and order here, you know, because none of this stuff was in the.

You know, with the way the bookends there, you know, the whole lawn order thing. It's just kind of, not part of the story in the book. And I think that scene where Lou meets the quote unquote new Brady makes up for it, you know, because it was in that moment. I was like, they are putting this character through hell and she's literally the only one who could stop, whatever is about to happen because everyone else felt helpless. You know, the prosecutor felt helpless. Bill and Holly could not do anything. Drum couldn't do anything. You know, bill was brutally attacked by. To, to, you know, not too long before this. And you have these characters who, by the way, his ex-wife does play a much bigger role in this as well. You know, she's kind of just mentioned in passing here and there and the books, if I'm not mistaken, right.

[00:26:13] Terry Mesnard: I completely forgot that. She was a thing. Um, yeah.

[00:26:18] Deanna Chapman: Yeah. And, you know, she has a more prominent role. She's kind of like trying to take care of bill and go see their daughter and do all these things.

[00:26:27] Terry Mesnard: Nancy Travis though.

[00:26:28] Deanna Chapman: Yeah.

[00:26:29] Terry Mesnard: I love her. Uh, so I married an ax murderer. I love her.

[00:26:33] Deanna Chapman: Yeah. And you know, I think this buildup with Lou and Brady really made me feel okay with how this ended and. We know how smart both of these characters are because they did all of that work in season one, you know, just because they were working at a computer store, you know, doesn't mean they weren't capable of doing things outside of that computer story that evolved tech and whatnot.

So, you know, to completely spoil it here for anyone listening, if you're listening and haven't watched this, I, you know, Maybe stop now, but you have Lou going in to testify. And this is basically a competence hearing. It's not the actual trial. The trial didn't even get to its official starting point with the jury or anything.

This is just to determine Brady's competence. She gets on the stand. She answers all of the questions. You really feel like she's doing a great job and you know, Brady's lawyer doesn't really attack her in the way I was expecting, which surprised me and I was pleasantly surprised by, you know, I was glad they didn't go that way with it. And then she just pulls out this 3d printed gun and shoots him in the eye.

[00:27:49] Terry Mesnard: Oh my god. When she was on the stand, all I kept thinking was, yes, leave it to a queer woman to solve all the us straight PR people's problems and, you know, and get him to justice. And then the moment that the defense attorney is, he's just sitting there and he's calling me like, did you, have you ever seen him cry before and all this kind of stuff and just kind of poking holes into every little thing that she says, even though everything that she says should have been enough to convict, to make it seem that he is competent to go to trial and just pokes holes. And she walks up to him at the very end, says, I do not forgive you. I do not am blam. I was gagged. I was shocked I was like, I cannot believe that that just happened.

[00:28:26] Deanna Chapman: Yeah. Did not see it coming. I mean, we see her buy a real gun and you're like, okay, obviously she can't take that to the courtroom and they don't do any setup for this. We don't see it coming. And you know, she's so unsure of herself and whether or not she's going to be able to do this. And the fact that she did this after not really being attacked on the stand. But just, you know, she knew.

[00:28:55] Terry Mesnard: Yes, I, yes. I was like, oh my God. And I am curious. I, cause I, I did look up on IMDb and I know that she's going to be in season three. And I'm just curious to see what's going to happen with her because the season sort of ends, even though it has like a finite ending in terms of bill's like storyline, like they could have ended the show after this, if they hadn't gone to third season and it would've given his story a little bit of a closure, I was still going there. What's what's happening with her because he's at the very end, just happily painting. And I'm like, well, what about the person that saved the day?

What is, what happened with her? And I wanted to know, so. It actually made me really excited to start watching the next season. Cause I, I really related to her character and I thought that they did a good job, even though she does vanish part way through the season of like showing this sort of survivor's remorse and wanting to know why, why did I survive when he could have easily have killed me?

And just the, the loneliness that she felt. I really thought this season did a good job of portraying that sort of. The victim of PTSD aspect of it.

[00:29:59] Deanna Chapman: Especially when the guy starts following her, you know, and she beats the crap out of, you know, she gets off on it because you can tell this guy, he doesn't like other people telling him what to do.

And he definitely does not want to admit that this woman beat the crap out of him. So, you know, he's not pressing charges or anything like that. So, you know, she gets out and. You see the struggle with her and this character played a much bigger role than I really expected given what we see of her in the books and you know, different name in the books.

It's Freddie Linklater in the books. And. I think, you know, just kind of changing things up a little bit, make sense for TV. A lot of times, especially when you are dedicating 10 episodes to something, you know, you mentioned watching Lisi story recently, and that was eight episodes. And even that. Long, and I agree I did like it, but you know, that that's for another episode, but with this, you have to tread very carefully when you're covering a trilogy.

You know, we mentioned how production wise and schedule wise, it made sense to flip books two and three, just so you get a complete story because you're right. If they would have done finders keepers and not had the Brady storyline wrap up and they didn't get renewed for a season three. It's kind of like, oh, oh no.

And I think, you know, the only thing I can think of as far as why this would be safe is because AT&T had complete control, they weren't pitching it to another network. They owned the network. So, you know, sure the executive still could've canceled it, obviously as many do with TV shows, but. Maybe because it was on a smaller platform and a smaller channel that not as many people had access to, it had a higher likelihood of them just telling the stories they wanted to tell with all three seasons.

But, you know, I've seen things where people want to season four and things like that. And I'm like, eh, I don't know if I would want more seasons of this because there are definitely shows. Are on much longer than they should be to put it nicely. You know, I am someone who watches all of the CW DC shows because of reasons that I don't totally understand, but so many of them are just still going and I'm like, I think we need to stop team.

[00:32:37] Terry Mesnard: Yeah. Okay. Speaking of the DC aspect though, What this season really hammered home is sort of like the, it, it made me kind of chuckle a couple of times because they're really kind of like focusing on, on the sort of joker Batman connection between bill and Brady, where at one point, um, I think it's Ida even tells them you're an addict.

And Brady is your, your drug and he made your life richer, more exciting. He brought you back from the dead bill. And which might explain why you're trying to bring him back from the dead. I wrote that line down because I'm like, okay, you are really hammering home this, like we need each other. We're like the flip, the flip of the coin where the, the joke, you're the bat, the joker to my Batman.

And that's something that this, that this season in particular, they, they sorta did a little bit in season one, but this season really ha um, hammered home with like, uh, there's a scene. Bill is having trouble peeing. He's having trouble urinating and it cuts between him peeing and Brady peeing into like the, the, the bag in his hospital.

And there's like in season one, there was the scene where, um, bill is like dancing with Janie. Y. Brady is like, will they, won't they with, with his mom at one point? And so there's these aspects of it that the, that this season and last season, but this season in particular sort of like focused in, on that sort of addiction, that sort of like he is your, your joker aspect of it.

[00:34:00] Deanna Chapman: Yeah. I think one thing maybe two things this season could have done is take away from the shots of him just lying in the bed and take away some of those workout scenes. My goodness.

[00:34:14] Terry Mesnard: Yeah. Well, I, you know, I was thinking, what is the mystery here? First season didn't really have necessarily mystery. We know who did the crime, we know who the bad guy is, but it's sort of a cat and mouse here.

We don't really have a cat and mouse game that plays out. I mean, I guess a little bit in terms of him sending different people to go try to kill bill, but like there was no mystery to it. And the only the mystery for me was like, how is he doing this? And that was sort of half-baked and it never really was completely to my satisfaction answered of the it was this device, it was this go fish game. It was, you know, the, the, the drugs, but there was nothing that like kept me interested in, in Brady's storyline. And I actually kind of wish that they had left it a little bit. Open-ended in the beginning as to what is really going on with like the, the nurse that commits suicide or, you know, how that finally turns violent.

Like they wanted, they interjected these things where the characters would say something that obviously we're at to infer Brady is talking through them, but it would have been, I think, a little bit more impactful if it was sort of like left up to the imagination through the beginning part is to what is really going on instead of hammering home that we are seeing

brady and his control center back in his basement, I get that they wanted to have Harry do something more than just be an occasional senior too. And give them a bit more of a meaty role. Cause if I was an actor, I probably would want, if I'm coming back for a season, I'd want to have a much more meatier role than just being a patient in a hospital bed.

But I don't know. I just, it kind of took away the, the tension for me.

[00:35:43] Deanna Chapman: Yeah. It felt like they just kind of lingered too long on those things. I don't think they should have cut them completely. You know, just thinking off the top of my head here, it might've been a little better paced if they had bill and Holly going after Cora more, you know, because they find out all of this stuff about her and they do absolutely nothing about it.

[00:36:06] Terry Mesnard: Nothing. Yeah.

[00:36:09] Deanna Chapman: They just end up watching her on TV and they're all like, oh, she's good.

[00:36:15] Terry Mesnard: She's going to do the Fox news circuit. That was basically what I got out of her character from that. Yeah.

[00:36:20] Deanna Chapman: Yeah. So I think maybe take away some of those lingering shots of Brady in the bed, Brady working out because we did still get plenty of scenes where people are going into the room to visit him. And he's there, you know, or he's looking through Sadie's eyes or owl's eyes. And, you know, he has all of those moments where we could still see him in his head. And you know, that scene with Roby where robot. Dead Roby is, you know, helping him figure out how to mind control people. And, you know, there were just some things that I think could have been cut down a little and made room for more interesting story lines and plot points that they could have followed because they definitely set up all of that stuff with Cora and then it just, it was dead in the water.

[00:37:08] Terry Mesnard: Yeah. A lot of really good ideas. I just don't think the execution was that great. Unfortunately, in some, in some regards, but I loved, I love the final episode of this, even though I was like, oh, we're going to get a court.

We're going to get a courtroom scene. And I think overall the season sort of does a good job. Of tying everything together and making the ending field stronger than maybe some of the events leading up to it would imply. But yeah, I just, I don't know, in terms of the entire season, I think I actually prefer the first season better.

[00:37:37] Deanna Chapman: Yeah, I do too. And I think the good thing about season two is that it still makes us invested in the main characters, you know, bill and Holly are kind of in this tense spot because bill keeps going and doing things that's putting the business in jeopardy and Holly's like, you're going to sign this thing so that I don't lose the company because you're being stupid, you know?

And he's like, okay, that's fair. And you know, you have little moments like that, that I think still keep our attention enough and keep us invested in these characters enough. And, you know, you have Jerome and his struggle with Harvard, which, you know, they could have gone into a little more. And you mentioned earlier and I totally did not really answer you on this, about Ida and the funeral home. And there's a very quick passing moment where she's like, I inherited that. You know, that's not what I enjoy doing, you know, that's not my passion. And she was like, you know, this is why I teach summer school because I used to do this and I kind of wanted to get back to it and, you know,

[00:38:42] Terry Mesnard: I totally missed that.

[00:38:43] Deanna Chapman: It was so quick. It was honestly so easy to miss. And, you know, we're probably all guilty of looking at our phones or tablets or whatever, while we're watching stuff, especially something like this season where it was definitely slower than season one. And you're like, okay, Brady's in the hospital bed again.

And you know, so it was definitely just like a quick five second line or something like that. And I feel like it still held my attention enough and I still enjoyed it to where I'm actually really interested in how they're going to portray the finders keepers novel now, because they don't have that whole aspect of Brady hanging over bills.

[00:39:27] Terry Mesnard: Yeah, I wanted to go back. Cause you mentioned the, um, the sort of Holly and bill aspects of this. And I actually wanted more of that because one of my favorite parts of this of the season was early on when he is kind of teaching her how to be a private detective. And it's, it's sort of like these moments of it kind of made me laugh where he's like, okay, I want you to, you know, do a three-part turn.

And she's like, what is that? And he's like, do it, you, and he's like trying to teach your teacher how to be. How to take over the job in case, you know, he is no longer doing it and she wants to have a successful business. I love the scene where he's like, all right, now you're going to sit out here and you're going to watch this house and you're gonna tell, call me if, if she, you know, stirs.

And then she's like, okay, it's the next day? And he's like, yep, you're going to keep doing this for another 24 hours. And they're just like, it's moments like that, that I was like, okay. I like that there is a little bit of more progression in terms of their character more progression in terms of this business, that all of a sudden stood up overnight.

In between seasons like I'm sure there's time that passed between it, but for us, it's like all of a sudden, boom, you know, they're doing a private detective agency. So I enjoyed that. We were getting a little bit more. Relationship building between the two of them. Because once we get to the back half of the season, it's more, you know, him and trying to nail Brady down.

And so it's like we kind of lose that relationship that was barely introduced in season one. And I felt was started to kind of progress here and then just sort of, kind of took a back seat in terms of the plot. But I liked that earlier segment with her.

[00:40:57] Deanna Chapman: Yeah, we didn't talk about the prosecutor too much. And I feel like he was that character who was supposed to be the quote unquote, good guy.

And you find out he's kind of not. And then, you know, His dog, very sympathetic to that. And you have sort of that whole storyline too, that I think really took over, but still required us to spend a lot of time with Brady, which I think was a little unfortunate, but I had no expectations going into this like we both said in season one, we didn't really know what to expect. I had heard it was good from. Maybe a few people who were able to watch it when it was on. But I still think that even though this season differs quite a bit from end of watch, it was still good TV. It wasn't something where I was like, oh, you know what I don't feel like watching season three now, obviously I can't be like that. I have to watch it. I have told myself that I have to do this for whatever reason. I decided, you know, I'm very interested in season three because of the changes they made this season.

[00:42:02] Terry Mesnard: Yeah. I'm, I'm going into season three. I'm excited to see what's going to happen with, uh, um, with Lou.

And I'm excited to see this, the story that, um, I've more recently read the book on. So like I have that more in my mind and I'm curious to see what they're going to change. And I, I am kind of spoiler alert. I did look and see Nancy. Travis is not in season three, so whatever happens. Him and his ex-wife is apparently not going to happen at all in season three.

It's just unceremoniously dropped. Maybe they couldn't get her to come back for another season, but.

[00:42:34] Deanna Chapman: She does play tim Allen's wife in last man standing. So maybe she was busy with that at the time. So I only know that cause my parents watched that. And they're like, oh, that lady, I was like, yes, that is who that is.

[00:42:48] Terry Mesnard: And see, my connection is from the nineties with, uh, so I married an ax murderer. That's my connection with

[00:42:53] Deanna Chapman: possibly a more fun connection there. You know, Terry, thank you so much for joining me. This was fun to discuss, not as good as season one, not terrible TV either by any means really, you know, we were kind of nitpicking here, but I think, you know, Certainly have quite a bit to talk about with the season three with no more Brady Hartsfield. So I look forward to, uh, talking to you again soon.

[00:43:20] Terry Mesnard: Me too.

[00:43:21] Deanna Chapman: All right. That does it. For this episode of Chad cemetery, you can support the podcast on Patrion for a dollar a month. You'll get a thank you on the show for $2 a month. I will send you a chat cemetery sticker. And if you want to follow us on social media, you can do so at chat cemetery on instagram and Facebook, you could also rate and review the show. That's a huge help. And as always, thank you for listening and we hope you enjoy the rest of your day. .